A few questions

[Hector25E]

Hello,

After a long time playing this game I have some questions about it that I would like to discuss with you.

1)Why the mass of the piston didn't affect the resistance of the rod? If I build, with the same rod, an engine with cast pistons and another with forged ones, this last engine should be able to reach higher rpm without breaking the rod, isn't?

2)Why there isn't an slide to select the valves diameter? When the bore is increased, the game automatically set up the biggest valves that fit in this bore. This is great for the volumetric efficiency but not to reach high rpm. Everybody knows that increase the bore and decrease the stroke is a direct way to reach higher rpms, but no if we suffer valve floating. So, i think it would be useful that the user could choose a lower size of valves than the max one, this way we could get an engine with lower torque but with higher max rpm.

3)The maximum and min bore/stroke ratio isn't a bit restricted? I thing that specially lightweight forged pistons have to been able to reach higher bore/stroke ratios. Is not a limitation in the most engines, but, i think it would be easy to implement.

4)Why there isn't an option to activate/deactivate electronic assistance? This way we could get drivability and sportiness at the same time. I think this would be easy to implement too.

5)And finally I have been not able to see the video of the new revamp in progress of engine design. It will be a revamp of turbocharging? In my opinion, nowadays is the biggest disadvantage of a great engine designer.

Greetings and thanks for your time.

[Killrob]

1) True, that's an effect we've neglected so far, maybe worth looking into for the engine designer revamp.
2) Watch the Engine Designer Revamp Discussion video: https://youtu.be/JAZP2Rlq43c
3) Same answer here, with the new calcs we can probably allow for a larger range without introducing exploits.
4) Good point, considering it is possible to turn it off in most cars that have it and want to be sporty there should not be a penalty, although having a penalty I think is better for gameplay as there is more of a compromise. So we'll remove it and see how it plays.
5) FI revamp comes after the tycoon part is mostly done.

[Packbat]

Re: (4): I think maintaining a small penalty would probably be appropriate, as it is one more setting that can be in the wrong position on someone's car. I knew of someone who thought their iPhone ringer was broken when they had accidentally flipped the mute switch. But playtesting is probably the way to go, generally.

[Hector25E]

Hi, thanks for your asnwers!!

Another question here. Why the donwforce undetray generates drag? How the slide of donwforce undertray works? I thought that the ground effect didnt generate drag.

Greetings.

[TrackpadUser]

If you generate downforce (or lift), you will generate drag, doesn't really matter how you do it.

They work by using the bernouilli principle to reduce the pressure under the car, by reducing airspeed.

Here is a visual example from an older lotus F1 car.

[Killrob]

F1 cars are among the most drag-y cars in existence because of all the downforce they generate, their Cd values are insanely high.

[ArnRno]

Re: (4): I think maintaining a small penalty would probably be appropriate, as it is one more setting that can be in the wrong position on someone's car. I knew of someone who thought their iPhone ringer was broken when they had accidentally flipped the mute switch. But playtesting is probably the way to go, generally.

I think if we add things like ESP, traction control, power steering, etc., that the DRIVABILITY should increase, but the SPORTINESS should not, at least not as a direct response to the option...

What I mean is that putting, say, traction control shouldn't mess with the sportiness stat directly, but since all components weigh something, if the change in weight is enough to mess with sportiness directly, or enough to mess with the weight balance, then sure, let the stat drop - all cars I have driven with ESP have an override switch, so on track days, it shouldn't affect a darn thing. Same with traction control, or what have you. I say, going back to Packbat's point here, that if any stat should see a drop, it should be reliability, which I think already does get affected by some things - power steering is more stress on the engine (not a ton, but a bit), ESP, Launch Control, and Traction Control (usually) come with a new suite of electronics that, especially in earlier models, can really bring reliability down in the real world.

Two other small points, devs, if you're reading this -
Firstly, on the trans screen, it shows the actual power to the wheels on the graph, not the pure net engine power, so why when I put on or take off power steering, is this wheel horsepower not affected? If the Automation devs have developed a purely frictionless power-steering system that takes 0.0hp to run, then kudos to you.

Secondly, and I'm at work right now, so I can't verify, but if I put traction control on a car, why doesn't my wheel spin decrease? The drivability stat is the everyday-driving stat, right? Tameness? So when I want to be tame, you'd better believe I'd have the TC turned on, and while it does bump my DR stat, shouldn't it directly affect the wheel spin metric as well? On that note, I think the ABS option doesn't ever seem to alter my stopping distance either, and I really think it should - not every time mind you, but it's on a per car basis, some cars really benefit from ABS, other's don't. Oops, third point, my bad.

Side note - Hector25E, I love your questions.

[Killrob]

Firstly, on the trans screen, it shows the actual power to the wheels on the graph, not the pure net engine power, so why when I put on or take off power steering, is this wheel horsepower not affected? If the Automation devs have developed a purely frictionless power-steering system that takes 0.0hp to run, then kudos to you.

So how much steering do you do when accelerating in a straight line, or when sitting on the driving cycle test bench? We think losses due to power steering are so minimal we don't really have to consider them though. If you have good evidence of the opposite being the case, we can easily change that. AC on the other hand is a power sucker.

Secondly, and I'm at work right now, so I can't verify, but if I put traction control on a car, why doesn't my wheel spin decrease? The drivability stat is the everyday-driving stat, right? Tameness? So when I want to be tame, you'd better believe I'd have the TC turned on, and while it does bump my DR stat, shouldn't it directly affect the wheel spin metric as well?

It does lower wheelspin, but not the technical stat in the left-hand stat screen but in the effect that wheelspin has on drivability. You can check that by going to the detailed stats screen and check out Drivability - Wheelspin. When TC is on then the penalty is divided by 4.

On that note, I think the ABS option doesn't ever seem to alter my stopping distance either, and I really think it should - not every time mind you, but it's on a per car basis, some cars really benefit from ABS, other's don't. Oops, third point, my bad.

ABS doesn't alter the stopping distance independent of what car you are in, it just makes it easier for any non-perfect driver to get close to the optimal stopping distance. ABS does affect different cars differently, that will be much more pronounced in the update coming out in the next few weeks in which the whole braking system has been revamped.

[ArnRno]

I don't want to quote your whole reply, I'd make a huuuge ugly wall of text.

A: I really don't know what power steering saps from the motor as far as a real percentage, but I know it's something. I may be over estimating it, I just assumed it's signifigant. I DO know that one reason a lot of these modern cars today are going to (ugh) electric power steering is that it's supposed to help fuel economy, so that sounds like it's losing the parasitic drag from the engine the hydraulic pump was putting there.

B: I'll admit, I didn't look hard enough at the breakdown of the stats on the final page, just at the wheel spin stat on the trans page - I knew it was lowering the "actual" wheel spin, I just expected the number I looked at to change, no harm, cool, danke.

C: Got it, the "stopping distance" stat is the optimal stopping distance then - shortest possible stopping distance short of hitting that brick wall. Makes sense. When I said "I think it should," I meant more "I think it could." Never been a big fan of ABS myself, but hey, that's a different story.

and lastly, D: I really feel like I must annoy the hell out of you devs, if that's so, sorry!

[nialloftara]

Electric power steering effects city/urban driving far more than highway, however depending on the system that pump is still pushing fluid around on highways so ideally the game would have a year dependent value for it as technology has reduced the effect of hydraulic pumps over the decades. Seen here from hotrod magazine you can expect a 6-7hp and 7-8lbft dip on a big block dodge back in the 60's http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/130 ... vs-luxury/

[Killrob]

Thanks nialloftara, that's some good data. With those numbers of power losses it would be highly significant. We'll look into that and see what makes sense for the game. Cheers!

[koolkei]

oh wow. 6HP hydraulic pumps O_O

in that case i want to ask you guys something. not just the dev but all

Hydraulic/conventional PS vs Electric PS.

do you think this needs to be 2 different driving assist?

electric PS, especially cheap ones are more dull, less engaging, less sporty. therefore more comfortable, lower effort to turn.
but modern ones allow for variable steering gear ratio, (supposedly) lower the parasitic drag quite a bit (due to the power needed=more drag on the alternator), and higher performance ones gives quite a good feedback compared to hydraulic PS.

i know some of BMW and porsche cars now feature electric PS.



now we're talking about these. i just remember that most pre-80s car have vacuum systems that also have pumps running for 'luxury' stuff. but that's topic for another day

[TrackpadUser]

Like a lot of other options that would offer only minor differences, I don't really think we need to be able to choose the type, especially since properly tuned electric power steering can be just as good.

The power difference can probably be dealt with by lowering the required power as the years go.

One thing for sure is that it would help make it more viable to run no powersteering.

[koolkei]

so that's a no from you