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Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Fri Apr 24, 2015 5:19 amby Irkie500
Hey guys something I have noticed is that cars seem to grip way more than they should, and they also are much lighter than I think they should be. For example, I made an SUV all steel chassis, ladder style, steel body panels, cast iron engine, with hard compound tires(all "standard" interior options) and it pulled almost 1.0g in the skid pad. How is it that my 5600lb SUV with 245 wide tires is handling like a sports car? Something in the calculations seem off...
Also if you build a lightweight sports car it can pull stupid grip numbers, like 1.5 to 1.7g, which seems very improbable to me. I feel like my SUV should be maxing out at around .70-.75g.
Thanks!
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Fri Apr 24, 2015 6:34 amby BlastersPewPew
Yeah, I think it is also a bit too high, I know that the 2013 Ford Explorer managed 0.84 on the skid pad from Car and Driver but a similar creation in Automation gives much higher numbers. I will say though that this game is still being tweaked and adjusted so this may be something to be worked on later.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Fri Apr 24, 2015 6:40 amby Der Bayer
I totally agree regarding the grip problem. I mentioned it several times during beta testing and would suggest 15 to 20% less cornering grip.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Fri Apr 24, 2015 1:08 pmby Irkie500
Nothing against the devs, they are doing a fantastic job with the game. Im especially excited for v6's to poaaibly be released sometime soon. I just think a few morr calculations need to be tweaked. I find it hard to make a car a realistic weight. Cars built in 2015 should natually be heavier than those built in the 80's or 90's due to ever increasing saftety standards and standard equipment.
A typical sedan in 2015 should be weighing 3300-3800 pounds, right noe they are like 2800 which is way too light.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 1:24 pmby TrackpadUser
Which body materials and interior options do you have?
With AHS steel frame, steel body panels, standard interior/safety/infotainment, and a 2L I6 powering the rear wheels through a 5 speed automatic, I get about 1550 kg, which makes sense.
It might actually be a tad on the heavy side since it was smaller than a Camry which is ~1450-1500kg. But the difference can probably be explained by the RWD and fairly heavy engine configuration.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 2:55 pmby strop
Agreed with trackpad... Cars tend to be in fact perhaps a tad on the heavy side, but usually not underweight. My Civic replica was bang on the money with near complete fidelity.
But the grip, yes, maybe a little high for the lower end cars. Even that civic was pulling over a g on the skidpan... But at the same time with those figures the track times were realistic enough.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 7:13 pmby Der Bayer
That's because of the too constant cornering speeds. If the cars were accelerating and braking out of corners, lower cornering speeds would be ok.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 8:21 pmby Killrob
Yes, lateral Gs are far too high right now, but like Martin says this is because otherwise track times would be about 10% slower and I think people would complain about that more than too high Gs.
We'll implement Martin's solution to better track calculations at some point later down the line, which will give more realistic track times without the crazy Gs.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 9:15 pmby strop
Fantastic, you got it all covered!
And yes you're right Killrob, I would totally bitch about inaccurate times more than lateral G...
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sat Apr 25, 2015 9:50 pmby Sayonara
trackpaduser wrote:It might actually be a tad on the heavy side since it was smaller than a Camry which is ~1450-1500kg. But the difference can probably be explained by the RWD and fairly heavy engine configuration.
A 2013 Accord is about the same weight, although it can get up to 1550 depending on trim, and 2011 Legacy wagon is 1600-1650, so weight is more or less where it should be for a mid-size/D-segment car.
Modern cars are heavier than you'd expect, all the weight savings go back into the interior and safety (Automation's sure got that right).
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sun Apr 26, 2015 2:30 amby RobtheFiend
An Audi A3 with 3.2l v6 and Quattro weighs over 1800 kg. A 60's muscle car with 7l cast iron engine and heavy rear axle weighs about 1600kg.
Lots of extra crap in modern cars.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:44 amby Sayonara
RobtheFiend wrote:An Audi A3 with 3.2l v6 and Quattro weighs over 1800 kg. A 60's muscle car with 7l cast iron engine and heavy rear axle weighs about 1600kg.
The A3 was never available with a V6, as far as I'm aware.
Assuming you meant A4, the 3.0 TDI A4 weighs 1755kg unladen. That's not unreasonable, given that it has a 3.0 litre turbodiesel and all-wheel drive - and it's the same weight as a 1970 Challenger with Hemi V8.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:09 amby BlastersPewPew
Sayonara wrote:RobtheFiend wrote:An Audi A3 with 3.2l v6 and Quattro weighs over 1800 kg. A 60's muscle car with 7l cast iron engine and heavy rear axle weighs about 1600kg.
The A3 was never available with a V6, as far as I'm aware.
Assuming you meant A4, the 3.0 TDI A4 weighs 1755kg unladen. That's not unreasonable, given that it has a 3.0 litre turbodiesel and all-wheel drive - and it's the same weight as a 1970 Challenger with Hemi V8.
It was the VR6 version of V6, from 2003-2009.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:07 amby maffc
IMO, the VR6 isn't really a V6, it's just a slightly wiggly I6.
A real V engine has two separate heads, again IMO.
Re: Grip too high, cars too light?
Posted:
Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:09 amby Drake
maffc wrote:IMO, the VR6 isn't really a V6, it's just a slightly wiggly I6.
A real V engine has two separate heads, again IMO.
Agreed
