New cornering tests

[Packbat]

I've been watching a lot of sim racing recently (and earlier I wasted a truly enormous amount of time playing Forza Motorsport 2 and 3), and thinking on that, I had some ideas for some suspension setup information that might be better than simple Driveability and Sportiness.

Basically, the key scenarios that I can think of to set up my suspension to handle are:

• Turn-in under braking. That is, the transition from "full braking straight-line travel" to "constant-speed constant-radius cornering".
• Acceleration during corner exit. That is, the transition from "constant-speed constant-radius cornering" to "full-acceleration straight-line travel".
• Stability during sudden maneuvers. There's actually a standard test for this: the ISO lane-change maneuver, informally known as the moose test.

For the first two tests, I'm not entirely sure what to suggest, but perhaps maximum lateral g's at a specified speed during full braking and full acceleration, respectively? With indication of whether the car tends to oversteer or understeer?

This third test, on the other hand seems relatively straightforward to state: the maximum speed at which the maneuver can be executed (and, again, whether the car is understeering or oversteering - or both).

(It might also be good to have indication of lift-off oversteer for front-wheel-drive sports cars, but that might be a little too arcane to include.)

This is partly inspired by Der Bayer's BRC challenge, but I feel like I'm mostly fumbling in the dark right now with suspension setup - these kind of numbers would give me the kind of information that I paid the most attention to when I was playing Forza like mad back in the day. A car that can turn harder at maximum acceleration is a car that can get on the throttle earlier on corner exit, and a car that can turn harder during braking is a car that can brake later into a corner via trail braking.

[JussiE]

Okay idea but I'm not entirely sure if it is valid or meaningfull for basic road cars i.e. family sedans etc. Maybe sports cars or so and these would be intresting stats to have but I'm not sure if worth implementing... These are sort of already included in the sportiness stats and others.

[nialloftara]

The moose test is already calculated,
Quoted from the suspension crash course
"Body roll test
The body roll test is similar to the moose or fishhook test. The maximum lateral acceleration out of the circle test is taken into account: The car is driving a corner with that acceleration in one direction and pulling to the other direction after a short time. The focus is on the roll angle of the car body. This will first reach positive numbers and then negative ones, levelling off at a certain value.
Out of this test you get the maximum absolute roll angle and if that becomes too big and things like track width, height of center of gravity, roll inertia and suspension roll centres are coming together in a unfortunate way, the car can roll over. Currently, this is quite difficult to achieve, as the fake total weight slider moves down the center of gravity quite a bit.
Big maximum roll angles will be rated not tame and not sporty."

[Packbat]

Interesting - thanks, nialloftara!

Would it be possible to add other information besides angle of roll to that? I'd like to know whether the car tends to oversteer or understeer during that maneuver, and to what extent.

[Intrud3r]

i would like to see a more complete understeer oversteer information too it's hard to set the awd f/r% otherwise
to stay in topic why driveabilty and sportiness have two different understeer/oversteer stats? a well balanced car isn't good for both?

[Daffyflyer]

to stay in topic why driveabilty and sportiness have two different understeer/oversteer stats? a well balanced car isn't good for both?

A slight bias towards understeer is preferred for driveability, as it's a much easier situation to deal with for a novice driver, and is generally the "safe" way to lose grip.

A slight bias towards oversteer is preferred for sportiness, as a slightly oversteery car is generally more agile and able to be made to turn in nicely at speed. Also because it's easier to hang it sideways like an idiot


Too much bias towards either is a nasty car to drive, full stop.

[Intrud3r]

thanks for the answer on the stat screen wasn't that clear or at least i'm unable to find if it's understeering or overersterring i have always negative % (the best i got was a -0.2% in sportiness and -4% in driveabilty) so basically a 0% or + values on sportiness is a slight oversteer and a +% under driveabilty is slight understeer right ? so -14.4% Driveabilty -0.4%Sportiness is too oversteer?
the awd front/rear balancing seems only affect wheelspin on my cars
btw i have always preferred oversteer and rwd for practical reasons like more steering angle and lesser tire consumption (if not doing donuts all the day )

edit: found this guide on the forum (i missed it when i briefly looked at forum sections) viewtopic.php?f=13&t=3446 that answered mi qestions sorry for the unnecessary question