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Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

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USDMFTW

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 2:49 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

phale wrote:Wow! That's really impressive! Care to share any special tips? (I want this challenge to be as much about learning and sharing knowledge as it is about showing off :D )


Not good at teaching, but you have to find the proper balance of compression, ignition timing and boost along with getting the cam value right to match the low end power and vvl for high end. Also make sure the engine is over square to keep piston speed down to keep reliability at a decent number. Also, use cast iron heads and block. I6 also seems to be the most efficient way of making power with hilarious fuel economy. I could get an I4 to around 140 points but no higher.
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phale

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:13 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

I have also found that short stroke (oversquare) engines give the best score. However, realistically speaking, a 1.6L oversquare takes up as much total volume as a 2.0L square. The 2.0L square gets both better performance and efficiency, but gets a lower score because of its greater displacement. But if I were picking an engine to put into a car, I'd take the 2.0L. So I'm considering changing the rules again to account for total volume instead of displacement - this would tip the balance towards long stroke, which would be counter-balanced by the reliability factor. I think this would give some advantage to I4s and Vs, right? Plus give a reason to not use DOHC. Thoughts?
Last edited by phale on Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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USDMFTW

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:23 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

phale wrote:I have also found that short stroke (oversquare) engines give the best score. However, realistically speaking, a 1.6L oversquare takes up as much total volume as a 2.0L square. The 2.0L square gets both better performance and efficiency, but obviously gets a lower score because of its greater displacement. I'm considering changing the rules again to account for total volume instead of displacement - this should give more advantage to I4s and Vs. (Also would give a reason to not use DOHC.) Thoughts?


Its difficult just to have a simple formula to calculate this as the 2.0 might get better fuel economy on paper, but may get worse fuel economy in an actual car(according to in game calculations). Such as an example for my Leopard Hatchback, the base 200 hp non turbo version gets the same fuel economy rating as the turbo 300 hp one which has a much lower economy rating in the engine tab. The best way to do it, in my opinion would be to make a a series of cars and have people design an engine for each one. So for example:

fwd city car ~2500lbs
rwd 4 door ~3500lbs
suv ~5000lbs

Allow each person to add their own engine and modify the gearing to match the engine.


Or to forgo all of that, i would just change the liters to weight in kgs.
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phale

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

USDMFTW wrote:Or to forgo all of that, i would just change the liters to weight in kgs.

I like that idea! There are some very interesting balance decisions to be made there (VVL vs. no VVL, NA vs. Air/Air turbo vs. Water/Air turbo, exhaust size, etc). It would definitely require a different ruleset, I don't want everyone choosing titanium conrods just to save a few kgs...

I want to keep this simple and restricted to engines, but it does look like a full competition with cars would be more realistic and accurate. I liked Packbat's engine competition so a modern 2016 version of that would be pretty cool. I'll think about it.
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USDMFTW

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:37 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

phale wrote:
USDMFTW wrote:Or to forgo all of that, i would just change the liters to weight in kgs.

I like that idea! There are some very interesting balance decisions to be made there (VVL vs. no VVL, NA vs. Air/Air turbo vs. Water/Air turbo, exhaust size, etc). It would definitely require a different ruleset, I don't want everyone choosing titanium conrods just to save a few kgs...

I want to keep this simple and restricted to engines, but it does look like a full competition with cars would be more realistic and accurate. I liked Packbat's engine competition so a modern 2016 version of that would be pretty cool. I'll think about it.


Then add a cost component to the calculation. I could try to help with the calcs if need be, i run a review thread in the car design sharing forum.
viewtopic.php?f=41&t=10029
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phale

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:41 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

Right - but I would have to differentiate material costs and production costs, and by the time I put all of those into an overly-complicated equation it would be simpler to just do the full car. I would like to do a car competition, but that would require a lot of effort and organization, haha. The idea behind this was to keep things simple :)
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USDMFTW

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Post Sat Apr 02, 2016 3:48 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

phale wrote:Right - but I would have to differentiate material costs and production costs, and by the time I put all of those into an overly-complicated equation it would be simpler to just do the full car. I would like to do a car competition, but that would require a lot of effort and organization, haha. The idea behind this was to keep things simple :)


Once the open beta releases i think the factory tab will have the cost per engine, including the factory options of course. Could use that.
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Rossriders

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Post Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:27 pm

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

I'm tempted to at least try though I'm in some doubt even though I was able to get...very close to 30% with a V8 OHV...I'm trying to see how I can actually get past that point successfully while staying within displacement confines.

That's not going to be easy...screw it, not like I can 'win' anyway.
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pyrlix

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Post Fri Apr 08, 2016 7:22 am

Re: Efficient Performance - The Engine Design Challenge

@Rossriders: We have a new forum at http://discourse.automationgame.com
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<Killrob> you commited a lot of crimes... among others against: 1) international minimum intelligence laws 2) human rights to a brain 3) act against devolution of the human mind
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