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Prices, production untis and Economy questions

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RioRedSVT

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Post Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:51 am

Prices, production untis and Economy questions

ive been getting pretty good, i think, in Sandbox mode. im trying to do my own "Version" of the tycoon bit. im trying to give myself to budget per year, in prices and Production Units, but dont know how "Real" the economy is on the game. so what is a "cheap" to "expensive" range for the decades? are they close to real life? and what are the production units? what is a lot, what is a little?

A side question what is the cheapest car anyone has made? because i feel that my cars cost too much for the 40s but i dont know how to make them much cheaper??
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nialloftara

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Post Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:00 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Just remember everything is in stable 2014 adjusted amounts. So that car from the 40's costs the equivalent to $15,000 today not the $900-1000 US dollars a ford sedan actually sold for back in 1941.
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Prasiatko

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:52 am

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

I've been using this to convert.
http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/
Although of course doesn't take into account time and wages.
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nialloftara

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:18 am

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

But you don't have to, the game value doesn't change, so a $7000 total cost car in 1940 is still that price in 2020 as far as I understand it.

* Or are you talking to get real life prices to compare?*
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Prasiatko

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:48 am

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Yah. So for example a thousand dollar car in 1946 would give us ~$12000 in game
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RioRedSVT

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 3:29 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Thanks for the input ya'll! i understand the game is a set price from 1940-2020, i was trying to convert it to a "realistic" price in real world. for example i made a 1940 "Common Man Base Model" it costs $4978 after all is said and done with 195.8 Production Units. so i want to know what a ~$5k car in game would be how much in the 40s in real world, does that make sense?
Ill try that inflation calc. see if that helps what im looking for.

Now my BIG issue is the Production Units. what are they? i assume they will have a tutorial about it when the Tycoon mode is finished. but until then ill be playing my own "Tycoon" mode. so if anyone knows what is low, normal and high units for a car? and if a Dev reads this maybe shed some light on Priduction Units to try and help me understand how they will be used in Tycoon mode?
1999 Ford Mustang SVT Cobra: Rio Red, 5spd, Short Throw Shifter, 3.55s, Lowering Springs. Otherwise Factory.
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Killrob

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:19 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Production units are a measure of effort required to produce a certain part or car. Factories, depending on their tech, will produce a certain number of production units if fully staffed. A production unit in 1940 hence is much more than a production unit in 2020 because of automation (not the game :P). Also, your almost 200 production units is a lot by modern standards ;)

Regarding inflation, you can't use the official calculator for anything after the 80s because the US government has manipulated the official inflation numbers a lot since then (changed the calculations over and over again, always to the downside). If you have 70s pricing you can compare that to 40s and 50s pricing, but you can't compare / recalculate 2015 pricing to 50s pricing using those calculators. shadowstats.com does give a more realistic picture of inflation measured by the official government calculations used in the 80s. :)
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07CobaltGirl

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:55 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

So what you're saying is, the $1000.00 car from 1946 wouldn't cost $12k in 2015, as displayed in the calculator at www.usinflationcalculator.com , but probably closer to $40k due to the US government's tweaking to make itself look better? (using ~7% inflation average from 1980 through current year on top of the calculator's data)
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Killrob

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:55 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Yes, correct! There is about a factor of 3-4x missing I would estimate. :)

Another way to estimate prices is to convert to ounces of gold and then back. Gold is money, currency is not (it's a non-backed IOU). In 1946 an ounce of gold was $35, which means a car costing $900 was 25.7 ounces of gold. Even with today's suppressed gold prices (suppressed by big bank short selling, central bank leverage and derivatives not covered by physical metal), that would be around $31000 today. As you can see, a much better measurement of value :)

In the game we will calculate prices in money units, not currency, but display it in currency units. Sounds weird, but that's the only good way of tracking actual value throughout the game and converting to currencies.
Historic gold prices: http://www.kitco.com/scripts/hist_chart ... graphs.plx
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Mason148

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:24 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

I don't understand what you mean about money units. Does that mean that the prices of cars won't change from 1940 to 2020 or what? Also does that mean a car will cost the same throughout the world because for instance a bmw is cheaper in america than in england so how will all of this work?
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Killrob

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:27 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

No, that is not what I'm saying.

"Currency" is not "Money" but people call currency money, which is confusing. Internally Automation will work with money units (units of actual value), but those money units will be converted into a currency (like "Dollars"). So prices will change over the years.
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Mason148

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:31 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Will we set prices in the money units and the game convert it to the currency for each region dependant on the year?
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maffc

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Post Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:54 pm

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

From previous discussions about this my understanding is that prices will be displayed and set using the one currency unit, regardless of the target sales zone. It would be a bit too much for gameplay to have to factor in exchange rates as well as other financials.
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Prasiatko

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Post Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:19 am

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Killrob wrote:Yes, correct! There is about a factor of 3-4x missing I would estimate. :)

Another way to estimate prices is to convert to ounces of gold and then back. Gold is money, currency is not (it's a non-backed IOU). In 1946 an ounce of gold was $35, which means a car costing $900 was 25.7 ounces of gold. Even with today's suppressed gold prices (suppressed by big bank short selling, central bank leverage and derivatives not covered by physical metal), that would be around $31000 today. As you can see, a much better measurement of value :)

In the game we will calculate prices in money units, not currency, but display it in currency units. Sounds weird, but that's the only good way of tracking actual value throughout the game and converting to currencies.
Historic gold prices: http://www.kitco.com/scripts/hist_chart ... graphs.plx

How well will gold work considering the market completely changed with the end of Bretton Woods in 1972? One thing i tried comparing to was how many months of median wage a car cost as although that assumes that people pay the same % of their income on a car.
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Killrob

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Post Sat Jul 11, 2015 5:21 am

Re: Prices, production untis and Economy questions

Prasiatko wrote:How well will gold work considering the market completely changed with the end of Bretton Woods in 1972? One thing i tried comparing to was how many months of median wage a car cost as although that assumes that people pay the same % of their income on a car.


The question could equally be how well it worked before Betton Woods ended in 1971 :) because at that point the US printed money like crazy but kept the value of the dollar locked to gold... which made more than just the French suspicious. ;) But you are of course correct in that the gold price is over-/undervalued at times and then doesn't make for a good price translation. The same is true for your method, too, which has the problem of median income lagging behind,etc. I don't think there is any perfect method of determining correct sales prices without taking into account the whole world economy.
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